Conversation on Doc Rivers (P. 2)

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Agent0
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realbull17 wrote:
Chris Paul told Steve Ballmer the main reason why he left was Doc Rivers. 😢
I thought it said Doc was a contributing factor, not the main reason. I'm going to go out on a limb and say the one of the main reasons was joining up with an MVP caliber co-star who doesn't miss many games and GM Morey. Not that Doc was good in his dual role, but I think that might have drawn him more than Doc pushed him away.

Doc making promises of roles and minutes that he can't keep, the Austin dynamic having unintended consequences, Doc always trying to sell himself, even lying to do so, sounds like normal Doc life.


clipper*joe
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Agent0 wrote:
I thought it said Doc was a contributing factor, not the main reason. I'm going to go out on a limb and say the one of the main reasons was joining up with an MVP caliber co-star who doesn't miss many games and GM Morey. Not that Doc was good in his dual role, but I think that might have drawn him more than Doc pushed him away.

Doc making promises of roles and minutes that he can't keep, the Austin dynamic having unintended consequences, Doc always trying to sell himself, even lying to do so, sounds like normal Doc life.

I don't know, I think not trading for Melo is what did it for for CP3. I have no proof of that but if I had to guess, based on sequence of events that is the main reason why Doc was stripped of his GM duties, Remember, Doc wasn't stripped of his GM duties until after Ballmer met with CP3 to see why he left. Why else would Doc be stripped of his GM duties if it wasn't about what Doc did, or didn't do as GM? Players usually don't leave a FULL MAX at the age of 30 to risk playing 1 season with another star who tends to choke in the play-offs. Something must have really pissed him off for CP3 to do what he did this late in his career. IMO


jarca
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SamMays wrote:
Talked to a buddy of mine who is a well-known sports writer. His inside view was that the Doc/Austin combination is not actually cancerous within the organization as many of us seem to think it is. Austin is liked and supported by his teammates.

Interesting.

Uh oh. Clipjoe’s head just exploded


Agent0
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clipper*joe wrote:
I don't know, I think not trading for Melo is what did it for for CP3. I have no proof of that but if I had to guess, based on sequence of events that is the main reason why Doc was stripped of his GM duties, Remember, Doc wasn't stripped of his GM duties until after Ballmer met with CP3 to see why he left. Why else would Doc be stripped of his GM duties if it wasn't about what Doc did, or didn't do as GM? Players usually don't leave a FULL MAX at the age of 30 to risk playing 1 season with another star who tends to choke in the play-offs. Something must have really pissed him off for CP3 to do what he did this late in his career. IMO
Quite possible. A lot of players are "chokers" until they get the right teammates and team and then they no longer are. I don't think stuff like that is relevant in players minds when choosing teammates. You could see how frustrated Paul got every time Griffin got injured, or even he got injured, he certainly knew he wasn't doing anything in the playoffs by himself, and even with his injuries, Blake's were just far worse in both the RS and playoffs their last few seasons together.

I don't think it was not trading for Melo in itself, but the reports that the Clippers were holding out Austin in a trade for Melo. Whether they were true or not, there were other reports that said the Knicks still weren't going to trade him (Phil was kind of being dumb), but just the fact that something like that comes out is an issue, and that's why you don't have player/ (GM/coach) on a team. I do believe Doc being stripped of his President duties were in the works already, but that might have pushed it ahead of schedule. I believe when it was reported in summer it was said that Paul lost trust in Doc, and didn't think the organization (and really I think this meant Doc) was fully committed to winning.

Doc is such a survivor, it is in a way impressive. The guy will lie through his teeth to make himself look good, and seeing how he does it publicly, there's no doubt he does it privately too. His contract probably helps him since the team is probably thinking that they aren't going to be contending next year, so what's the point of paying two coaches. Also West said they were evaluating him this season, and whether we agree or not, the FO seems to be impressed with his coaching job this season, so that might be keeping him around.


clipper*joe
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jarca wrote:
Uh oh. Clipjoe’s head just exploded

If it's not in print, I pay no mind. Thanks for your concern though. Smile


clipper*joe
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Agent0 wrote:
Quite possible. A lot of players are "chokers" until they get the right teammates and team and then they no longer are. I don't think stuff like that is relevant in players minds when choosing teammates. You could see how frustrated Paul got every time Griffin got injured, or even he got injured, he certainly knew he wasn't doing anything in the playoffs by himself, and even with his injuries, Blake's were just far worse in both the RS and playoffs their last few seasons together.

I don't think it was not trading for Melo in itself, but the reports that the Clippers were holding out Austin in a trade for Melo. Whether they were true or not, there were other reports that said the Knicks still weren't going to trade him (Phil was kind of being dumb), but just the fact that something like that comes out is an issue, and that's why you don't have player/ (GM/coach) on a team. I do believe Doc being stripped of his President duties were in the works already, but that might have pushed it ahead of schedule. I believe when it was reported in summer it was said that Paul lost trust in Doc, and didn't think the organization (and really I think this meant Doc) was fully committed to winning.

Doc is such a survivor, it is in a way impressive. The guy will lie through his teeth to make himself look good, and seeing how he does it publicly, there's no doubt he does it privately too. His contract probably helps him since the team is probably thinking that they aren't going to be contending next year, so what's the point of paying two coaches. Also West said they were evaluating him this .

No matter what happened, CP3 is the last man smiling...errr...Standing.


Agent0
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clipper*joe wrote:
No matter what happened, CP3 is the last man smiling...errr...Standing.
Yea, guess he ran away at the right time and to the right spot, we'll see how Houston does in the playoffs though, and how his health holds up. In the end Blake actually ended up getting the worst deal. From LA to Detroit and to a lottery team with no draft pick this year. Clippers aren't in to bad a position, two lottery picks, discovered some young talents, cap will open up soon, can't complain too much.


toohipcliptoslip
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clipper*joe wrote:
If it's not in print, I pay no mind. Thanks for your concern though. Smile

Was Cicero in print? Yellow_Flash_Colorz_PDT_08


clipperboy24
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SamMays wrote:
Talked to a buddy of mine who is a well-known sports writer. His inside view was that the Doc/Austin combination is not actually cancerous within the organization as many of us seem to think it is. Austin is liked and supported by his teammates.

Interesting.

His dad is the coach, I highly doubt they bad talk Austin when it almost certainly will put you in the dog house. Also how many sportswriters have we seen just completely get the picture wrong. From Skip Bayless to David Aldridge and everyone in between, they don’t always get it right.


cleepers
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Agent0 wrote:
Doc is such a survivor, it is in a way impressive. The guy will lie through his teeth to make himself look good, and seeing how he does it publicly, there's no doubt he does it privately too.

Nailed it.

I'd be fine with a lesser -- but more honorable -- head coach to lead us forward.


Keatonsays
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Waiting for the second coming of the Sam Cassell era


jarca
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Keatonsays wrote:
Waiting for the second coming of the Sam Cassell era

So you’re looking for a player to play 1 good season and then injured the rest?


clipper*joe
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jarca wrote:
So you’re looking for a player to play 1 good season and then injured the rest?

I think he means as a coach...Second coming?


clippyclip
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I know it's Peter Vecsey, but still. *crosses fingers

Quote:
Peter Vecsey: Rivers is guaranteed to go, it says here. A revamped roster in mid-February dictates a demand for a new voice with new ideas with a new image. Owner Steve Ballmer, who inherited Rivers when he purchased the Clippers and gave him lots of leeway, has had plenty of time to figure out Doc is a stone phony. He took away one title (president) from him prior to this season. The time has come to relieve him of his coaching duties, pay him the $10M owed for next season, and offer Villanova’s Jay Wright a blank check. GM Lawrence Franks’ second choice, I’m told, is Jeff Van Gundy. 2 hours ago �" via Patreon

http://hoopshype.com/team/los-angeles-clippers/


clipper*joe
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clippyclip wrote:
I know it's Peter Vecsey, but still. *crosses fingers

Good call on Vecsey! Not the most reliable source but it is nice reading it.


realbull17
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Clippers gave permission to the Knicks to interview Mike Wooden.


clipper*joe
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clipfan63
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laboy wrote:
Lets trade Doc for a first round pic...

He destroyed this team, and his player substitutions are very suspect..

He played his son 30+ minutes and other players 5 minutes or less.

He is constantly getting out coached.

We missed the playoffs because of him.

There were some games where something was working and he changed the line up..

I figure he cost us 5 or 6 games this year!

We should have won 50 games this year.

He knew that Beverly and Gallo were injury prone..

And he did nothing...get them extra care..limit their minutes from the beginning.

Harell should have been the starting power forward with Harris at small forward, and Gallo should have come off the bench. Bobo should have been playing 15 minutes a game..

He was playing more when he was with his old team and was 3rd string center?*&%$#@

Little rivers is not a point guard! Period!

He and his 12 million dollar contract need to be traded if he opts in!

Doc made so many stupid trades, and maxed out the payroll and gave away all of our pics!

And some of you guys want him back next year??????

Haven't heard anyone say they WANT him back, some of us are just saying that the ugly reality is that at this point it appears to be the most likely outcome.


clipperboy24
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clipfan63 wrote:
Haven't heard anyone say they WANT him back, some of us are just saying that the ugly reality is that at this point it appears to be the most likely outcome.

I could list a few posters who have said they want him back because he did a good job with such a limited roster.


Keatonsays
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jarca wrote:
So you’re looking for a player to play 1 good season and then injured the rest?

1st Sam Cassell era as player

2nd Sam Cassell Era as Coach.

I like how he's helped Austin develop and he's always been a good leader. Doesn't necessarily mean he'd be a great head coach but he's my favorite for the job.


SamMays
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A lot of college coaches haven't transitioned very well, but Jay Wright would be a great gamble.


bebe
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I've said for years Doc needs to go. Sure he had a good season with what or who he had on the roster this season but that was luck and the young players determination. I'm sure Jerry will come up with a good pick. I don't see Doc being here next season.

Go Clips

The Nevada Fans


toohipcliptoslip
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It mattered not what CP wanted. With Melo we still weren't contenders. He wasn't the answer. With CP alone we weren't contenders. CP is Robin, not Batman. He needs somebody better than him, in tandem to win. It wasn't BG or DJ. It wasn't Melo. We could not have upgraded that team to make them competitive especially with GSW. Where are you Ricky Davis? I would take a choking Hardin drunk over CP (I'm irrational - so what) but CP with GSW is a handfull. CP and Klay!! CP with this squad and a Batman is a handful. Couldn't happen.

Doc for President. He can lie as well as any we've had. "I did NOT have sex with that woman.-- I had sex with her dress. She did NOT have sex with me, she had sex with my cigar. When I found out I fired it. My d*ck just accidentally fell into her mouth when I wasn't looking. Accidents do happen you know. It's so big that it's difficult to keep in my pants" I won't even mention Trump's large hands. (I just did, oops).

"My only bribe was a Cocker spaniel named Checkers. although I don't think he really had one (puppy that is). "I AM NOT A CROOK!" --Richard Nixon, for you children. Ah yes, Tricky Dick, in the present political atmosphere we semi miss you.

Doc should be a used car salesman on Spanish language TV. "I've got a used Chevy , just like new--- cheap." Is Paul Pierce the same as a used Chevy? Doc should change his name to Richard. We could have Tricky Dick and Dick Doc.

David cut me some slack. I've behaved myself for a long time.

On to my second Guinness!


cobra
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deleted...


LAC_12
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SamMays wrote:
Talked to a buddy of mine who is a well-known sports writer. His inside view was that the Doc/Austin combination is not actually cancerous within the organization as many of us seem to think it is. Austin is liked and supported by his teammates.

Interesting.

Really? I know that it irked CP3. And it even draws suspicion from me (Joe and I BOTH think he plays too much.) Although he is vastly improved, I still think he is playing 5 min more than he should. I know that might not sound like much... but with Ty and Sindarius and CJ, would love to see them tap some of that action.

Even if it not an internal issue, I think it may be frowned upon by prospective free agents... I do not think it is a good idea to keep them together.

Most people want both of them gone, but I think we can keep one. But I do agree that at LEAST one of them has to go.


LAC_12
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clipper*joe wrote:
I don't know, I think not trading for Melo is what did it for for CP3. I have no proof of that but if I had to guess, based on sequence of events that is the main reason why Doc was stripped of his GM duties, Remember, Doc wasn't stripped of his GM duties until after Ballmer met with CP3 to see why he left. Why else would Doc be stripped of his GM duties if it wasn't about what Doc did, or didn't do as GM? Players usually don't leave a FULL MAX at the age of 30 to risk playing 1 season with another star who tends to choke in the play-offs. Something must have really pissed him off for CP3 to do what he did this late in his career. IMO

Agree with this. The degree of "reason" why CP left can be argued... Doc as a GM not pulling the trigger for Melo; Doc playing his son too many minutes; Docs coaching; chemistry with BG (and the lack of star-level from his #2); the fact that he signed on to be a #2 and yet his supposed #1 was not pulling weight so he had to assume #1 role which pissed the supposed #1 but had trouble speaking up and bottled everything inside causing a big rift.

It was never one reason... but Doc was a reason.


LAC_12
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Agent0 wrote:
Yea, guess he ran away at the right time and to the right spot, we'll see how Houston does in the playoffs though, and how his health holds up. In the end Blake actually ended up getting the worst deal. From LA to Detroit and to a lottery team with no draft pick this year. Clippers aren't in to bad a position, two lottery picks, discovered some young talents, cap will open up soon, can't complain too much.

... and he got injured to close the season. Wink


LAC_12
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toohipcliptoslip wrote:
It mattered not what CP wanted. With Melo we still weren't contenders. He wasn't the answer. With CP alone we weren't contenders. CP is Robin, not Batman. He needs somebody better than him, in tandem to win. It wasn't BG or DJ. It wasn't Melo. We could not have upgraded that team to make them competitive especially with GSW. Where are you Ricky Davis? I would take a choking Hardin drunk over CP (I'm irrational - so what) but CP with GSW is a handfull. CP and Klay!! CP with this squad and a Batman is a handful. Couldn't happen.

Doc for President. He can lie as well as any we've had. "I did NOT have sex with that woman.-- I had sex with her dress. She did NOT have sex with me, she had sex with my cigar. When I found out I fired it. My d*ck just accidentally fell into her mouth when I wasn't looking. Accidents do happen you know. It's so big that it's difficult to keep in my pants" I won't even mention Trump's large hands. (I just did, oops).

"My only bribe was a Cocker spaniel named Checkers. although I don't think he really had one (puppy that is). "I AM NOT A CROOK!" --Richard Nixon, for you children. Ah yes, Tricky Dick, in the present political atmosphere we semi miss you.

Doc should be a used car salesman on Spanish language TV. "I've got a used Chevy , just like new--- cheap." Is Paul Pierce the same as a used Chevy? Doc should change his name to Richard. We could have Tricky Dick and Dick Doc.

David cut me some slack. I've behaved myself for a long time.

On to my second Guinness!

All that as a result of ONE Guinness?


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