Clippers vs. Denver Nuggets Game Day 2018-04-07

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david
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Please post your predictions for the game against the Denver Nuggets. The guys must do what well to get the victory? Which opposing player(s) should Los Angeles focus on? Will the game be first to 110 wins or first to 90 gets the W?


realbull17
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If we lose today we will be officially eliminated 😭. If we win there's still life 😊


bballman
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1,2,3, Cancun!


realbull17
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bballman wrote:
1,2,3, Cancun!
I guess so. they already getting killed. Sad


cobra
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bballman wrote:
1,2,3, Cancun!

Nah Alaska is the best for them a a lot of salmon.


realbull17
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only bright note so far. Tyrone Wallace working his ass off. Smile


Shaa-Maan
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oh my god Devin Harris is still in the league!? totally forgot about that guy.


ClipperDodger1214
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Nice to see DJ actually trying out there. We're going to need him if we want to pull this off.


ClipperDodger1214
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Well Austin sure seems like he's ready for Cabo.


Shaa-Maan
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The whole team is bad defensively, but man DJ just sucks on that end this year. He is no leader. When he doesn't have an angry midget screaming what to do, he has no idea. He's not protecting the rim and he's not sticking to his man preventing jumpshots. Just standing around in no-mans land, waiting for misses to pad his rebound numbers. Pathetic


Clippers(AUS)
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Sit DJ,Austin,Wes and just have some fun in the last couple of games.


LAC_12
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The season is over... not sure why people are critical. No playoffs, no reason to try really.


Shaa-Maan
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selfish basketball by Austin and Lou, pathetic effort by DJ and a mini run is gone, nuggets back on the horse... why didn't we keep Marjanovič in the game?


ClipperDodger1214
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No problems on offense. Defense, on the other hand.......


Shaa-Maan
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Harrell is not a good defender. And that's putting it mildly. But he looked like an all NBA defender compared to DJ at times this year. Even if he's not effective on that end, the effort is always there and he doesn't act like a big shot superstar on the court.


cobra
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Their suffering is over just prepare for fishing. At least Lou might win the 6th man of the year.


Shaa-Maan
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**** we had a run going, DJ comes in for Marjanovič, run is over, nuggets put the game away. I'm so sick and tired watching his lazy ass in a clipper uniform.

Dwight Howard all over again. Loses just a bit of athleticism as he approaches 30 and becomes useless.


ClipperDodger1214
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Well, this is how it has to end. But the good news is we can finally go in a new direction. With the lottery picks and FA, we could be a seeing a whole new team next season.


Clippers(AUS)
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Oh well on to the next yr but in saying that. When your season was on the line and you give that effort fcuking PATHETIC!!!! I think Ballmer needs to say bye to Doc. As good of a job as he may have done this yr I don’t think he is the man to take this team forward. We need plays and structures to fall back on when it all falls apart. Definitely need way more ball movement


ClipperDodger1214
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Clippers(AUS) wrote:
Oh well on to the next yr but in saying that. When your season was on the line and you give that effort fcuking PATHETIC!!!! I think Ballmer needs to say bye to Doc. As good of a job as he may have done this yr I don’t think he is the man to take this team forward. We need plays and structures to fall back on when it all falls apart. Definitely need way more ball movement

Doc came here to take trio of CP3, Blake, and DJ to the next level. He failed, plain and simple. He has to go. Really, he should've been gone after he blew the Houston series. But now we can finally cut our losses.


cisco805
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ClipperDodger1214 wrote:
Doc came here to take trio of CP3, Blake, and DJ to the next level. He failed, plain and simple. He has to go. Really, he should've been gone after he blew the Houston series. But now we can finally cut our losses.

Doc is one of those stubborn stains that can’t seem to come off. Lol. But yeah I agree with you guys I’ve been saying it we need a different looking offense and defense. Hopefully Jerry and Ballmer agree on this. I can’t bare another season with Doc.


Snafu
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Repped High Quality Post

CP3 and Blake had a part in the Clippers failure. They are gone. So why should Doc and DJ survive for their part in the failure? Sweep away the old and start anew. Now we'll see if Ballmer will reward failure.


realbull17
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If you want to write Steve Ballmer. Here's his email sballmer@clippers.com They monitor his emails. I'm sure he read them but won't reply back.


toohipcliptoslip
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As far as defense, that can be learned and Trezz has the perfect body type. He is too good offensively to keep him on the bench. What did Dallas Rios oops Austin Rivers do wrong? For the third time in recent history he had close to a double double. He didn't jack up shots or hold the ball for an iso. His passing was pretty decent. He played within the offense. What do you want?

They obviously didn't care. Also they didn't have the size to deal with Denver. Boban is a better player than DJ with one exception, he can't jump.He was hitting corner threes and he can draw fouls on Bigs but hit shots. He hustles. Did anybody consider that Austin may not want to play for Dad anymore. This has been his major problem for him. Get away from Dad and he can be judged on his own merit.

As far as DJ, is he showing his immaturity by dogging it? Does he know that he's gone? Maybe that's it. Maybe he misses BG. It also proves that we need a generic tall Slav who can shoot, anything that ends in "ich".

Speaking of Beverly, is there a place for him. We have one spark, Trezl. Patrick is a defensive spark. Tobias,and Trerzz will only get better. So will Ty and/or Thornwell.


Clippers(AUS)
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I went through the draft and looked for a second round big that we may be able to buy in on and this guy is from Serbia I think and has a very similar skill set to Jokic. Lacks Athleticism but is more like today’s bigs. What do you reckon


Icecoldclipper
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If DJ opts in that’s a great expiring big contract to have on the books. Any team wanting to unload a near max guy can send him to us. Maybe Wiggins or something with picks.


ClipperPostman
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Icecoldclipper wrote:
If DJ opts in that’s a great expiring big contract to have on the books. Any team wanting to unload a near max guy can send him to us. Maybe Wiggins or something with picks.

Why would DJ optin when he already turned out an extension worth 23-25 mill per year. He would have to be a moron to opt-in at this point, for less money and no assurance of money in the future in case of injury. DJ has one big contract left it wouldn't make sense to waste another year opting in to one more year.


clipfan63
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ClipperPostman wrote:
Why would DJ optin when he already turned out an extension worth 23-25 mill per year. He would have to be a moron to opt-in at this point, for less money and no assurance of money in the future in case of injury. DJ has one big contract left it wouldn't make sense to waste another year opting in to one more year.
DJ's not going to opt in, that's sheer fantasy. I know he's supposedly said he wants to stay here but all his actions say otherwise. His lax attitude here at the end of the season and putting his California mansion on the market a few weeks ago seem to indicate he plans to be somewhere else. Some bad team with cap space to burn will offer him enough. I'll miss his Ironman ability to stay healthy, but there was quite a drop off this season in his defensive prowess which was the main reason for keeping him in seasons past. In any case, I seriously doubt there's much chance of him opting in.


SamMays
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Snafu wrote:
CP3 and Blake had a part in the Clippers failure. They are gone. So why should Doc and DJ survive for their part in the failure? Sweep away the old and start anew. Now we'll see if Ballmer will reward failure.

Several straight 50+ win seasons is hardly a failure. Those were the best years this franchise ever had.

Only one team wins the championship. All else is not failure.


bballman
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clipfan63 wrote:
DJ's not going to opt in, that's sheer fantasy. I know he's supposedly said he wants to stay here but all his actions say otherwise. His lax attitude here at the end of the season and putting his California mansion on the market a few weeks ago seem to indicate he plans to be somewhere else. Some bad team with cap space to burn will offer him enough. I'll miss his Ironman ability to stay healthy, but there was quite a drop off this season in his defensive prowess which was the main reason for keeping him in seasons past. In any case, I seriously doubt there's much chance of him opting in.
this would be a good thing.


clipper*joe
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SamMays wrote:
Several straight 50+ win seasons is hardly a failure. Those were the best years this franchise ever had.

Only one team wins the championship. All else is not failure.

I don't know, when you bring in the coach you think will lead you to a title, and you did no better than the coach who wasn't considered anything but a bargain priced coach (Bulls paying part of the salary) , then it is a failure. Players looked much happier with VDN as a team than at any time Doc coached us. IMO


SamMays
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We never had enough talent to climb to the next level. Blame Doc the GM for the failure to win a title. He never gave himself the weapons because he squandered draft picks and choked on veteran signees who had nothing left in the tank.


clipper*joe
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SamMays wrote:
We never had enough talent to climb to the next level. Blame Doc the GM for the failure to win a title. He never gave himself the weapons because he squandered draft picks and choked on veteran signees who had nothing left in the tank.

Kinda weird that for several seasons, analysts had us playing for a title. Vegas gave us good odds for several seasons. Doc isn't a jekyll and hyde. Why do people insist that Doc is literally two people because he held two titles? Yes, he had the GM title but that makes it worse. he hand picked his players that in the end, he couldn't coach. So you mean to tell me because he sucked ass as GM, he isn't at fault for being unable to coach the the players he picked? You think Doc's coaching deserves a second chance when his son is playing the most minutes in a position he has no business playing? That isn't coaching, and that is why this team looks a hell of a lot different when Doc lets his son run the team.

Doc doesn't know how to coach. Have you been watching the team as soon as Milos went down? No ball movement. Lou, Austin, and Harris have just been chucking shots at will and a lot of it is just ISOs. Bottom line, Doc is just running the same old lame offense. Let the best players do what they want, and have your 6th man come in to try a chuck us back into the game. Same thing he did with Crawford. Doc is only as goods as his assistant coaches. Tibs can vouch for that.

Whether people want to agree with me or not, Doc has to go for the damage he did when he had the core. He would only come here if he had control of the FO, therefor, he should fall on the sword for demanding that title in order to coach. Anyone who thinks that he deserves a chance because he came here as a coach is totally missing the point. He wouldn't come here unless he was also GM. You can't separate his two titles because he came here owning both titles.


SamMays
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First, Doc and Austin is an untenable situation. I have said that all along. One of them needs to go. Even the worry of nepotism is a threat to the well-being of the team, possibly creating dissension in the ranks and acting as a negative for potential free agents. I won't bother addressing the Austin story. I think he's a good player, an ideal backup guard on a good team and starter on a team with a weak backcourt. I will address the issue of a man wearing two hats. Think of the Peter Principle, where a man rises to his level of incompetence and fails at this new job because of it. That is Doc. A successful coach, who becomes a GM and can't do it because the requirements of the job are very different. It's a GM's job to assemble the team while still addressing the future well being of the franchise. It's his job to evaluate talent throughout the league, G league, Europe and in college and work within the salary cap to provide the coach with as strong a team as possible, while maintaining a plan for the future. It's a full-time job. Doc didn't have time to do it while coaching the team. As a result, he reached for players who he had seen play well against his team, while not fully evaluating their overall performance and what they might have had left in the tank. Pierce, Jamison, Granger, Baby, Stephen Jackson, josh Smith and others were brought in to rekindle magic they had lost in previous years. A good GM, who had time to track their performance, evaluate the rate of their decline, would have known better. Doc didn't. It wasn't that he couldn't coach these players; it's that they were no longer the players he had hoped....


SamMays
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clipper*joe wrote:

Doc doesn't know how to coach. Have you been watching the team as soon as Milos went down? No ball movement. Lou, Austin, and Harris have just been chucking shots at will and a lot of it is just ISOs.

Lou and Austin are both attacking scoring guards. Neither is in it to make his teammates better or set them up for shots. They are in it to get theirs and if they see a pass along the way, they may or may not make it. You can't simply tell them to see the court better and move the ball. That's not who they are. You don' tell Babe Ruth to bunt more. I am not suggesting Lou or Austin are the Babe Ruth's of basketball. I am suggesting that telling them to run the team and become pass-first players is pointless. They can't do it. It's not who they are.

There is a place in the game for one dimensional scorers. For Lou and Austin, it's ideally with a second unit with limited minutes, where their liabilities as passers are limited because they are playing fewer minutes against second-unit competition, where most teams have similar liabilities. Some, of course, are so good at scoring, they become superstars.

Our backcourt was so weak and so beat up that Lou and Austin played way more minutes than they would on a higher level team. What choice was there? When Milos went down, what choice was there as to who would play PG? We never had Beverly or Bradley (an neither is really a PG despite their size). Evans and Wallace aren't ready to play NBA point.

So, of course ball movement stopped with Milos went down. Moving the ball around the perimeter means nothing. The defense just does their shell drill slides and are set to defend. You need a PG who can penetrate and kick (not what Milos does) or work magic off the pick and roll (which is what Milos does), or really push the tempo with forward passing on the break (which is also what Milos does).

Lou and Austin can't do any of that. I'm sure they would like to. They just don't have that feel for the PG position.


Agent0
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I disagree, but I actually don't truly disagree. One man can effectively man both a coach and President of Basketball Operations role, BUT, he would need these things:

-A great support staff, scouting department with multiple scouts, and multiple GM's including a cap expert. This means that day to day day he's barely doing much, he's trusting those guys and he's just doing vision and big picture.

-The ability to separate feelings about a player as a coach from objective reality about the player

Clippers barely had scouts, and there was no scouting department, just added this past summer. They had a GM, but he himself wasn't that experienced, and there was no "capologist", hence the whole bad Jared Dudley trade because of hard cap from using MLE.

So yes, it "could" work, but not the way the Clippers had it set up. You can't waste windows in the NBA, and while injuries were a factor, there was never any season we (at least I) went in thinking the Clippers were the favorite in the West, and maybe one season were I thought top 2, but they were always right on the bubble. In the past I showed the 15-20 year or so history that in the WC, teams outside the top 3 are rarely represented in just the WCF, not to talk about the finals, and out of the few that did get to the WCF, one or two were due to a team losing a maiin piece (eg: Westbrook 2013). Actually it is usually the top 2 records even in the WCF. So if you're landing at 4th or 5th you're really going in trying to be the exception every year.


Agent0
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SamMays wrote:
Lou and Austin are both attacking scoring guards. Neither is in it to make his teammates better or set them up for shots. They are in it to get theirs and if they see a pass along the way, they may or may not make it. You can't simply tell them to see the court better and move the ball. That's not who they are. You don' tell Babe Ruth to bunt more. I am not suggesting Lou or Austin are the Babe Ruth's of basketball. I am suggesting that telling them to run the team and become pass-first players is pointless. They can't do it. It's not who they are.

So, of course ball movement stopped with Milos went down. Moving the ball around the perimeter means nothing. The defense just does their shell drill slides and are set to defend. You need a PG who can penetrate and kick (not what Milos does) or work magic off the pick and roll (which is what Milos does), or really push the tempo with forward passing on the break (which is also what Milos does).

Lou and Austin can't do any of that. I'm sure they would like to. They just don't have that feel for the PG position.

Yup, solid post, and I'll give the team some credit, they found ways to generate ball movement out of drive and kick and quick attacks, etc, they really aren't bad with ball/player movement, just not great.

Also I try to not look at good player / ball movement as being like GS for example because what they have is great/elite ball movement, so if you're just good you won't look like them. I would say that compared to the average team, the Clippers ball movement has not been inferior. For the top level of player/ball movement, you need the personnel like you said, the shooting creates the spacing, you need ball handlers, you need multiple playmakers, so I try to judge it relative to talent and also relative to the average team. Also the offensive flow has its limitations, and that's one of the issues SA has faced. They still have the same principles, but no Leonard most of the season has taken them from 9th to 17th on offense and a large 3 pts/100 possession drop. The move the ball, but they don't have enough high level creators, so the offense bogges down too often. The principles means it looks nice when it clicks, but they have too many times where it doesn't and they are a below average offense.


toohipcliptoslip
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The jobs Doc had: Coach, GM and President of operations is only one job not three. Why? Because that's how Doc wanted it. It was a package that was non negotiable. He would have ALL of the power (and responsibility) or none. His title was "PresidentGMCoach" all one word never the twain shall part. If he failed as a GM, he failed as a coach as well because they were the same job. You can't say "the GM should have made choices that could have made Coach's life easier." The GM made the coach look bad--aka Doc made Doc look bad with no outside help .He has nobody to blame for ALL of our failures except himself. His hubris hurt the team more than nepotism ever did. Should he have accepted a job as an executive in a billion dollar company when he knew he's clueless??


clipperboy24
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toohipcliptoslip wrote:
The jobs Doc had: Coach, GM and President of operations is only one job not three. Why? Because that's how Doc wanted it. It was a package that was non negotiable. He would have ALL of the power (and responsibility) or none. His title was "PresidentGMCoach" all one word never the twain shall part. If he failed as a GM, he failed as a coach as well because they were the same job. You can't say "the GM should have made choices that could have made Coach's life easier." The GM made the coach look bad--aka Doc made Doc look bad with no outside help .He has nobody to blame for ALL of our failures except himself. His hubris hurt the team more than nepotism ever did. Should he have accepted a job as an executive in a billion dollar company when he knew he's clueless??

Honestly that really does sum it up, dug his own grave


clipper*joe
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toohipcliptoslip wrote:
The jobs Doc had: Coach, GM and President of operations is only one job not three. Why? Because that's how Doc wanted it. It was a package that was non negotiable. He would have ALL of the power (and responsibility) or none. His title was "PresidentGMCoach" all one word never the twain shall part. If he failed as a GM, he failed as a coach as well because they were the same job. You can't say "the GM should have made choices that could have made Coach's life easier." The GM made the coach look bad--aka Doc made Doc look bad with no outside help .He has nobody to blame for ALL of our failures except himself. His hubris hurt the team more than nepotism ever did. Should he have accepted a job as an executive in a billion dollar company when he knew he's clueless??

Well said. You can't compartmentalize his job when he didn't come in wearing just one hat. He made it perfectly clear that he would't come here unless he had total control. Trying to argue that he failed at a job he wasn't supposed to do, and therefor, he should be allowed to continue to coach is nonsense. No one forced him to take that much responsibility but that is what he wanted. Why should he benefit from this rebuild when it was he who helped cause it? If these were the old clippers with DTS,Sterling would have fired him already. Hope Ballmer does the same in the off-season. Rather yet, I hope Doc decides to leave. It would be a lot smoother for everyone if he did.


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