How CP3 Gambled And Lost (P. 4)

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bballman
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clipper*joe wrote:
Capela is more skilled than DJ. Capela will fetch more than DJ. IMO
I agree. People here overestimate DJ.


pageC4
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clipper*joe wrote:
Capela will get close to max. I am not convinced CP3 will be a Rocket next season. If he stays, I see him taking a big cut in salary. Not because he wants to, but because the Rockets won't commit to CP3 long term. I have a feeling Rockets might low-ball him. At his age, and injury history, expecting him to be healthy all the way to the finals is a pipe dream. Not only that, they're not a young team and most of their young assets, were traded away. It's only going to get worse as time passes because they're going into Clippers territory locking themselves into the same old players to keep that window open. Too much up and coming teams now with a lot of youth that you can't lock yourself up trying to beat the Warriors with the same cast. Thank god we don't have that problem anymore.
I can't predict what Houston will do considering CP. However, judging by the fan base reaction, they may be willing to give it another go with Paul based on the fact that it was an injury that took him out. I have a feeling that they are certainly looking at that 3-2 lead going into game six and thinking...we almost had them. Remember, that Houston's fan base and front office do not have the extensive history to judge CP on like we do, and I have a hunch this lone season is going to cloud their judgement. I just couldn't tell you if they give him max or he accepts less...things to look out for this summer. BTW, what us the date for the Rockets to extend or max him?


Agent0
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clipper*joe wrote:
Welp, even the lowly Clippers were able to beat the Dubs in their house without CP3 this past season. Something we were not able to do with CP3 against the pre-Durant Dubs.
I meant playoff games, not sure if that was clear, but no one else has taken them to more than 5 games yet, but we'll see what Lebron can do even with a worse team than last season.


slestack11
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bballman wrote:
I agree. People here overestimate DJ.

I think this season, DJ is still better than Capela but Capela is younger so should fetch better offer.


Agent0
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I can't agree on this one, I would have favored the Rockets over a healthy Spurs also. Paul plays too well vs SA and the Rockets defense is just so much better than last season when they still pushed the Spurs to 6. The Rockets were a 71 win pace team in 58 games of Paul, even a little higher, I think 73 win pace when Harden/Paul/Capela played. I think we underestimated how good they were healthy, which is why we were maybe more surprised than we should have been that they pushed GS this far. It might be a hill you die on situation now, but Carmelo is likely irrelevant to Paul right now, don't think he cares, and especially not after Melo's performance with OKC. What Paul wanted to is compete, that was accomplished, no doubt, and if he stays with Houston, they can probably still do so as long as he realizes he needs to take a cut, but window is limited and his health is still not trustworthy. With his career earnings both from salary and endorsements, what's the extra money he missed out on actually going to do? Doesn't change his livelihood at all. Of course Houston was winning without him, they weren't going to become a lottery team, but there's winning and there's WINNING. You should check the Rockets record with and without Paul. Ignoring the last game of the season rest where they lost:
    15-8 (.652, 53 win pace) without Paul 50-8 (.862, 71 win pace) with Paul
Harden played all those games Paul missed. They went 10-4 after the first game he played, but had a favorable starting schedule, only 5 of those teams were +.500 teams at the end of the season and they went 3-2 against those teams. They weren't a contender last season,....


sz123456
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clipper*joe wrote:
Capela will get close to max. I am not convinced CP3 will be a Rocket next season. If he stays, I see him taking a big cut in salary. Not because he wants to, but because the Rockets won't commit to CP3 long term. I have a feeling Rockets might low-ball him. At his age, and injury history, expecting him to be healthy all the way to the finals is a pipe dream. Not only that, they're not a young team and most of their young assets, were traded away. It's only going to get worse as time passes because they're going into Clippers territory locking themselves into the same old players to keep that window open. Too much up and coming teams now with a lot of youth that you can't lock yourself up trying to beat the Warriors with the same cast. Thank god we don't have that problem anymore.

Just going with my opinion, but in my mind, zero chance he leaves Houston, coupled with zero chance he doesn't get the max. His future was orchestrated with Morey before Clippers knew anything about the situation. This was an under-the-table deal, securing that super max before uprooting his family. CP isn't dumb. He knows he's getting old and injury prone. He made Morey unofficially guarantee that super max from the get-go.

Sure, Houston could renege, especially after he got injured again and it's only gonna happen more and more. Do stuff like that, FA will avoid that franchise like the plague. Kinda like how FA will avoid us for offloading Blake mere months after a massive extension lol.


pageC4
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sz123456 wrote:
Just going with my opinion, but in my mind, zero chance he leaves Houston, coupled with zero chance he doesn't get the max. His future was orchestrated with Morey before Clippers knew anything about the situation. This was an under-the-table deal, securing that super max before uprooting his family. CP isn't dumb. He knows he's getting old and injury prone. He made Morey unofficially guarantee that super max from the get-go.

Sure, Houston could renege, especially after he got injured again and it's only gonna happen more and more. Do stuff like that, FA will avoid that franchise like the plague. Kinda like how FA will avoid us for offloading Blake mere months after a massive extension lol.

the Blake trade isn't going to hurt us one bit. Just like showing loyalty to a player won't either...after the love the Lakers showed to Kobe, did that attract free agents?No, players come to a team for a myriad of reasons

  1. A chance to contend

  2. A bigger paycheck

  3. No other offers

  4. Play for their hometown

  5. Etc

Even in the height of Sterling's era, we still managed to sign Cassell, Brand, Paul and many others considering we had a known racist and miser as an owner...This won't hurt us at all, and if we assemble a young core the league will pay attention. Boston did this well, traded beloved guys and they are right back in contention. As long as West make the right moves we are there.

So far I have mixed feelings about West:

  1. Loved the Paul trade

  2. Loved the Griffin trade

  3. Hate the Gallo trade

  4. Hate the Doc re-up (huge f#ck up)

    West still has a chance to get in the positive territory though, we will see


sz123456
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^^Disagree, we look like liars after the Blake trade, FA don't like that. Every promise we make during a meeting will be met with an eye roll, "Yeah, uh huh, I bet you said the same thing to Blake during free agency..." No one wants to sign a five year deal, set up a new house and new life just to be traded. Lou signed with us because of security -- he likes it here and I'm sure got a guarantee from front office that he wouldn't be moved, that's why we could get him for so cheap. With that in mind, if we trade Lou, that's kind of f'ed up and future FA would blacklist us.

Also disagree with your Kobe/Lakers comparison. Lakers were literally the worst team in the league, circumstances are different now. FA like the loyalty they showed Kobe, and they'll probably sign some studs this off-season or the next.


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sz123456 wrote:
^^Disagree, we look like liars after the Blake trade, FA don't like that. Every promise we make during a meeting will be met with an eye roll, "Yeah, uh huh, I bet you said the same thing to Blake during free agency..." No one wants to sign a five year deal, set up a new house and new life just to be traded. Lou signed with us because of security -- he likes it here and I'm sure got a guarantee from front office that he wouldn't be moved, that's why we could get him for so cheap. With that in mind, if we trade Lou, that's kind of f'ed up and future FA would blacklist us.

Also disagree with your Kobe/Lakers comparison. Lakers were literally the worst team in the league, circumstances are different now. FA like the loyalty they showed Kobe, and they'll probably sign some studs this off-season or the next.

once again...Blake doesn't matter neither does his trade...disagree all you want.players come to team regardless of trading a player. Also, as a player if you're worried of being uprooted you're in the wrong profession. Lakers haven't done sh#t and won't because they have a crap team whose figure head is Lonzo Ball. Also, you say the teams word is sh#t after Blake, why did Lou sign? Lou signed after Blake was dealt...there were rumors of the clippers shopping him, which they were. Lou is a vet he knows the business, and he knows his future isn't here.but if he can stall his family's move by a year or two..great for him. Lou resigned, fresh off the Blake trade..your argument is wrong

Boy those go!den state warriors lost out on FA by trading Monte Ellis...free agents will hate and avoid that franchise for a long time...see where I'm getting at. Free agents have different motivations....trading a soft, defensive challenged, trainer puncher power forward or a midget, injury prone, Chihuahua insecure point guard won't affect anything


Agent0
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Its certainly an issue with agents, so it depends on who else Blake's agent represents. Yes, it wasn't a move made in good faith and as an organization it won't haunt you forever, but it can affect how players feel about joining your team for a season or two. You just have to do some extra work convincing.

Still, in the end, money, role, lifestyle, all those things will overcome other things for a lot of players, it's the star players who have a lot more options that a situation like the Blake situation becomes more of a factor.


toohipcliptoslip
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BG is an ass*ole. Everybody in the league knows that. I'm sure that through the grapevine, everybody knows the truth. Most of you haven't looked at this from the FO's POV. They are stand up guys. If you were them WHY IN THE BLUE HELL would you trade BG, your "retired jersey player" after the $ and praise? Could it be that BG somehow reneged, he lied - about what we will never know. Nobody has ever considered this. This is far more likely. Why would you leave your fiancee at the altar (Like BG did?)

LAL didn't show love for Kobe, he had them by the balls. No Kobe means no fans and a team that's G League.. Kobe should have taken a pay cut. He made $25 mill in endorsement.

The only way a FA will come here is $ and lifestyle. What other incentive do we have? None. We will get mid level journeymen PJ Tucker and maybe some high level journeymen, JR Smith. JJ. when he's on. If West gets a mega star, things will change thanks to CP putting us on the map.


Clemenza
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Blake is not friends with Team USA guys nor The Banana Boat click. Now if we did this to DJ it might be a different story. No free agent cares what we did to Blake. People also know we babied him for years as well.


pageC4
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Clemenza wrote:
Blake is not friends with Team USA guys nor The Banana Boat click. Now if we did this to DJ it might be a different story. No free agent cares what we did to Blake. People also know we babied him for years as well.
exactly. Winning solves a lot of problems, and as soon as we establish a decent team, players will come here. However, I do believe that with the current landscape our focus should he on improving the club through the draft. At the moment we do not have the right team to entice the free agents that want a ring. So we should abandon pursuits of LeBron, Kawhaii and others. We can build a good team around our picks and Harris and Harrell


Agent0
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Man you guys are rough on Blake. I will say that, yes, with a lot of things that have come out since, he doesn't end up looking the best. CP now seems to be the one that was actually good friends with the core guys as we now see that Redick and him were close and he was going to join him in Houston, Luc went to play with him, Barnes said he is his fav teammate ever, DJ says they talk everyday like CP had said before, etc. So sure, in hindsight, it seems like Blake was sort of the thorn that sparked a lot of chemistry issues and he's had some off court distractions. Still, I think I read in another thread that he was a waste of a #1 pick or something to that effect, later retracted, I believe, but still, sheesh.

I get the idea that he's not really down with guys around the league, so they won't feel close to the situation. Still, it might be a factor, but one for a season or two, and I'm not sure the Clippers are true players in the FA market until then anyways, so by then no one will even care or remember. If they are, it might just require some extra convincing and wining and dining, Doc's expertise funny enough.


sz123456
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pageC4 wrote:
once again...Blake doesn't matter neither does his trade...disagree all you want.players come to team regardless of trading a player. Also, as a player if you're worried of being uprooted you're in the wrong profession. Lakers haven't done sh#t and won't because they have a crap team whose figure head is Lonzo Ball. Also, you say the teams word is sh#t after Blake, why did Lou sign? Lou signed after Blake was dealt...there were rumors of the clippers shopping him, which they were. Lou is a vet he knows the business, and he knows his future isn't here.but if he can stall his family's move by a year or two..great for him. Lou resigned, fresh off the Blake trade..your argument is wrong

Boy those go!den state warriors lost out on FA by trading Monte Ellis...free agents will hate and avoid that franchise for a long time...see where I'm getting at. Free agents have different motivations....trading a soft, defensive challenged, trainer puncher power forward or a midget, injury prone, Chihuahua insecure point guard won't affect anything

Management matters. Image matters. Think anyone goes to play for Philadelphia if Colangelo is still there? Ever wonder why no one came to the Clippers when Sterling was in charge?

Are you comparing Lou to someone of significance? Is he even in the top 50 of current NBA players?

Monta Ellis? Having trouble understanding your comparison lol. Monta Ellis went against his contract and broke his leg in a dune buggy accident, of course they traded him, they had good reason.


pageC4
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sz123456 wrote:
Management matters. Image matters. Think anyone goes to play for Philadelphia if Colangelo is still there? Ever wonder why no one came to the Clippers when Sterling was in charge?

Are you comparing Lou to someone of significance? Is he even in the top 50 of current NBA players?

Monta Ellis? Having trouble understanding your comparison lol. Monta Ellis went against his contract and broke his leg in a dune buggy accident, of course they traded him, they had good reason.

actually people did come to the clippers during Sterling's years: Elton Brand, Sam Cassell, Cuttino Mobley, Marcus Camby, Baron Davis, Chris Paul, Caron Butler, Chauncey Billups, and many others. As for players of significance, some of those I mentioned are going to be in the hall of fame. Kobe was even close to signing with the Clippers in 2004 if not for some last minute moves by the Lakers. These signings and near signings suggest that image doesn't matter.

Again, players get traded all the time. Players will play for bad owners, but here's what's going to hurt us in the present...a lack of players to contend. Players are looking to join teams that have a likely shot at the chip, which we don't. Occasionally, you might have good players who go to bad teams if their priority is simply getting paid, but I think LeBron James' Heatles set a new precedent and FA will look to get on stacked teams.


sz123456
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pageC4 wrote:
actually people did come to the clippers during Sterling's years: Elton Brand, Sam Cassell, Cuttino Mobley, Marcus Camby, Baron Davis, Chris Paul, Caron Butler, Chauncey Billups, and many others. As for players of significance, some of those I mentioned are going to be in the hall of fame. Kobe was even close to signing with the Clippers in 2004 if not for some last minute moves by the Lakers. These signings and near signings suggest that image doesn't matter.

Again, players get traded all the time. Players will play for bad owners, but here's what's going to hurt us in the present...a lack of players to contend. Players are looking to join teams that have a likely shot at the chip, which we don't. Occasionally, you might have good players who go to bad teams if their priority is simply getting paid, but I think LeBron James' Heatles set a new precedent and FA will look to get on stacked teams.

Nice list of players. Which ones were free agents when we acquired them? Players don’t have control where they are traded. Probably the most impressive FA on your list is Cuttino Mobley, and the only reason we got him...Ray Allen told us no that offseason, so we overpaid Cuttino in desperation.

You’re fighting this too hard. FA don’t like incompetent front offices or ones that appear to be scheisters. If a story breaks that Clippers went against their word and traded Blake because of domestic violence, racial insensitivity, behavior detrimental to the team etc, then we don’t look so bad. Until then, we need to rebuild our reputation a bit.


toohipcliptoslip
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Lou was a top 50 player this year. AS far as BG, yes I'm hard on him. Would you want his as a business partner or a son-in-law? Don't think so.There is a grapevine and I'm sure that all the players know what happened and why.

Players often have different priorities than we think they do. JJ's wife wanted to be in Philly. Elton's in laws lived in Philly. Jeff Green wanted to sign but Doc waited too long. Lamar begged to stay here but was released. Then there is identity which is different from ring chasing. Lots of guys would be proud to say "I'm a Laker and I played with Kobe". Some guys want to start. How many guys would have killed to play with MJ, even if they got fewer rings? There are business opportunities somewhere. Karl Malone's auto sales. The Mormons would like to be in Salt Lake City. Yes there were Mormons- Mike Smith and Jimmer)


Agent0
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sz123456 wrote:
Nice list of players. Which ones were free agents when we acquired them? Players don’t have control where they are traded. Probably the most impressive FA on your list is Cuttino Mobley, and the only reason we got him...Ray Allen told us no that offseason, so we overpaid Cuttino in desperation.

You’re fighting this too hard. FA don’t like incompetent front offices or ones that appear to be scheisters. If a story breaks that Clippers went against their word and traded Blake because of domestic violence, racial insensitivity, behavior detrimental to the team etc, then we don’t look so bad. Until then, we need to rebuild our reputation a bit.

Well, to an extent. CP was going to expire and would only pick up his option for certain teams, and the Clippers were on the list. Baron Davis was a free agent from the Warriors. It isn't irrelevant, but if other things are right, players will still come to a team, money, lifestyle, the ability to win, all those things talk a lot more in the end.


pageC4
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sz123456 wrote:
Nice list of players. Which ones were free agents when we acquired them? Players don’t have control where they are traded. Probably the most impressive FA on your list is Cuttino Mobley, and the only reason we got him...Ray Allen told us no that offseason, so we overpaid Cuttino in desperation. You’re fighting this too hard. FA don’t like incompetent front offices or ones that appear to be scheisters. If a story breaks that Clippers went against their word and traded Blake because of domestic violence, racial insensitivity, behavior detrimental to the team etc, then we don’t look so bad. Until....


sz123456
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pageC4 wrote:
trade or free agent is irrelevant

Dude, just stop lol. The argument was that FA won't go to a team if they don't trust the front office. Now you're talking about traded players. Just stop. New York is the biggest market in the country, yet FA don't go there. Why is that????

Face it. Any FA that wants to come to the Clippers this off-season is a bum. We'll sign some people, and they'll be garbage. Any player worth talking about is going elsewhere, to a front office they trust.

I don't even disagree with what our front office did. It was totally necessary. Fact is, we had to sign Blake at that time no matter what. We also had to get rid of him to have any kind of future. It needed to be done. Problem is we lured him in with a bunch of lies, told him that we'd retire his jersey, and compared him to Nelson Mandela. Free agents know we're full of sh*t now and our promises are meaningless,at least that's how we appear. We're not doomed for eternity, just look a little douchey at the moment. Probably blow over by 2019 offseason.


pageC4
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sz123456 wrote:
Dude, just stop lol. The argument was that FA won't go to a team if they don't trust the front office. Now you're talking about traded players. Just stop. New York is the biggest market in the country, yet FA don't go there. Why is that???? Face it. Any FA that wants to come to the Clippers this off-season is a bum. We'll sign some people, and they'll be garbage. Any player worth talking about is going elsewhere, to a front office they trust. I don't even disagree with what our front office did. It was totally necessary. Fact is, we had....


Clemenza
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sz123456 wrote:
Dude, just stop lol. The argument was that FA won't go to a team if they don't trust the front office. Now you're talking about traded players. Just stop. New York is the biggest market in the country, yet FA don't go there. Why is that????

Face it. Any FA that wants to come to the Clippers this off-season is a bum. We'll sign some people, and they'll be garbage. Any player worth talking about is going elsewhere, to a front office they trust.

I don't even disagree with what our front office did. It was totally necessary. Fact is, we had to sign Blake at that time no matter what. We also had to get rid of him to have any kind of future. It needed to be done. Problem is we lured him in with a bunch of lies, told him that we'd retire his jersey, and compared him to Nelson Mandela. Free agents know we're full of sh*t now and our promises are meaningless,at least that's how we appear. We're not doomed for eternity, just look a little douchey at the moment. Probably blow over by 2019 offseason.

You seem to be more upset than the actual players you claim are upset at us. Are you LeBron, Paul George, Durant, Bougie Cousins, etc ... and this is your online burner account? If not what are you so worried about? You'd be %100 spot on if we did this to DJ. Yes that courting of Blake was some bullsh*t but newsflash- nobody gives a f*ck cause he still got $150 million guaranteed. Matter of fact I don't feel like other stars wanted to play with Blake and I'm sure Jerry West and company knew this as well. Plus if I don't at least hear a Woj tweet about how bad we look to potential free agents cause of how we did Blake then nobody is upset enough not to come to the Clipps point blank. You're creating an entire scenario that doesn't even exist. Its all in your head.


Keatonsays
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sz123456 wrote:
Dude, just stop lol. The argument was that FA won't go to a team if they don't trust the front office. Now you're talking about traded players. Just stop. New York is the biggest market in the country, yet FA don't go there. Why is that????

Face it. Any FA that wants to come to the Clippers this off-season is a bum. We'll sign some people, and they'll be garbage. Any player worth talking about is going elsewhere, to a front office they trust.

I don't even disagree with what our front office did. It was totally necessary. Fact is, we had to sign Blake at that time no matter what. We also had to get rid of him to have any kind of future. It needed to be done. Problem is we lured him in with a bunch of lies, told him that we'd retire his jersey, and compared him to Nelson Mandela. Free agents know we're full of sh*t now and our promises are meaningless,at least that's how we appear. We're not doomed for eternity, just look a little douchey at the moment. Probably blow over by 2019 offseason.

I'm on the same page as you. Even a team like Dallas has had a hard time getting big names, and when they do sign someone, the end up overpaying for someone that's not as good as they need them to be.

I think it's in our best interest to avoid any big/long term commitments this summer anyway. If we pick well enough, we can have 2 solid contributing players on rookie contracts for the next 4 years allowing us to form a young core that would make us a more attractive FA destination in 2019.


toohipcliptoslip
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The one question nobody has answered. Imagine yourself as GM and had just promised BG the rings of Saturn. WHY would you do trade him? Everybody is acting like the FO is STUPID, irrational and vindictive and acted out of meanness alone just to screw BG. This makes no sense.

If you are West, was this your motivation and if you were GM would you do it? Unlike DTS, West has a good reputation. A leopard does not change his cliche. West is one of the best ever.

Again give some thought and ask yourself ---WHY WOULD you TRADE BG?

.


clippers88
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toohipcliptoslip wrote:
The one question nobody has answered. Imagine yourself as GM and had just promised BG the rings of Saturn. WHY would you do trade him? Everybody is acting like the FO is STUPID, irrational and vindictive and acted out of meanness alone just to screw BG. This makes no sense.

If you are West, was this your motivation and if you were GM would you do it? Unlike DTS, West has a good reputation. A leopard does not change his cliche. West is one of the best ever.

Again give some thought and ask yourself ---WHY WOULD you TRADE BG?

.

Easy. BG was never going to be worth the money. Now Detroit has to pay him north of $30 million a year in his thirties. Plus his character concerns and overall immaturity. To put it in simpler terms, BG ain't half the player a 33 year old Chris Paul is.


sz123456
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pageC4 wrote:
people don't want to go to NY because they aren't a contender just like we aren't. However, if LeBron suddenly signed there people would follow, not because NY is a big city but because they would suddenly be a contender. When we first got drafted Griffin we finally had something to build on. Paul was traded here and suddenly we were getting a lot of players...none who objected to being here. Caron Butler, Chauncey Billups, and even Kenyon Martin came mid way after being in China. I remember Chauncey told teams to not pick up his contract, he didn't want....


sz123456
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Clemenza wrote:
You seem to be more upset than the actual players you claim are upset at us. Are you LeBron, Paul George, Durant, Bougie Cousins, etc ... and this is your online burner account? If not what are you so worried about? You'd be %100 spot on if we did this to DJ. Yes that courting of Blake was some bullsh*t but newsflash- nobody gives a f*ck cause he still got $150 million guaranteed. Matter of fact I don't feel like other stars wanted to play with Blake and I'm sure Jerry West and company knew this as well. Plus if I don't at least hear a Woj tweet about how bad we look to potential free agents cause of how we did Blake then nobody is upset enough not to come to the Clipps point blank. You're creating an entire scenario that doesn't even exist. Its all in your head.

You think so? You think any halfway decent free agent will go to Philadelphia if Colangelo is still there? After all, free agents don't care about front offices, right? They'll still get their money if they play in Philadelphia. Does it matter if Colangelo is running the show? Why should it matter?


Clemenza
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sz123456 wrote:
You think so? You think any halfway decent free agent will go to Philadelphia if Colangelo is still there? After all, free agents don't care about front offices, right? They'll still get their money if they play in Philadelphia. Does it matter if Colangelo is running the show? Why should it matter?

You're changing the subject. The Philly situation is a whole different topic and way worse than how we treated one player. The Philly situation is a sh*t storm right now. Like I said I haven't heard a WOJ tweet/bomb or a serious comment from a big time agent then there's no story on this and you're definitely or rather desperately trying to add fuel to a non-existent fire.

Plus our GM/man in charge is non other than Jerry West. The guy who's responsible for the Laker championship runs and who's constructed these current Golden State Warriors. He's got all the cred in the world.


pageC4
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sz123456 wrote:
You think so? Name a halfway decent FA that signed in Cleveland while Lebron has been there? Remember, "free agent," not a Kevin Love who was traded there. Not a Kyrie Irving who was drafted there. A free agent who had a choice of where they wanted to go, and decided to go to Cleveland. The reason you'll struggle finding a halfway decent player is ... Dan Gilbert. The reason no one wants to play for the Knicks ... James Dolan.

Dude, Chauncey Billups, Caron Butler and Kenyon Martin were all bums! Literally bottom of the barrel vets on their last leg, practically already retired. I'm talking about "quality" free agents--players that can actually change a team's trajectory, players in the top 30 that are actually worth talking about. Not NBA journeymen or over-the-hill vets like Paul Pierce, Josh Smith, Lance Stephenson etc.

a team has a salary cap, and once they hit it there's little they can do to add and improve teams. Cleveland was in the same spot as we were : a playoff team with little room for big name free agents. There's no way they could add a kawhaii Leonard via free agents, so unless trades for these names came up (e.g. Kevin love) they can't acquire them. your

Proposed scenario with regard to Cleveland was the same that limited our ability to get a halfway decent free agent during CPs time here: cap limitations. This has nothing to do with Dan Gilbert, and again if Gilbert was so terrible why did James return? As for Dolan see my earlier posts


bballman
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pageC4 wrote:
a team has a salary cap, and once they hit it there's little they can do to add and improve teams. Cleveland was in the same spot as we were : a playoff team with little room for big name free agents. There's no way they could add a kawhaii Leonard via free agents, so unless trades for these names came up (e.g. Kevin love) they can't acquire them. your

Proposed scenario with regard to Cleveland was the same that limited our ability to get a halfway decent free agent during CPs time here: cap limitations. This has nothing to do with Can Gilbert, and again if Gilbert was so terrible why did James return? As for Dolan see my earlier posts

Even the Knicks, with their terrible ownership were able to sign Amare Stoudemire and got Carmelo both in their prime. I realize Melo was traded there but that was where he forced the Nuggets to trade him to, basically.


Agent0
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toohipcliptoslip wrote:
The one question nobody has answered. Imagine yourself as GM and had just promised BG the rings of Saturn. WHY would you do trade him? Everybody is acting like the FO is STUPID, irrational and vindictive and acted out of meanness alone just to screw BG. This makes no sense.

If you are West, was this your motivation and if you were GM would you do it? Unlike DTS, West has a good reputation. A leopard does not change his cliche. West is one of the best ever.

Again give some thought and ask yourself ---WHY WOULD you TRADE BG?

.

It's likely that West was not part of all the theatrics that were involved with signing Blake and he wouldn't have done that had he been the one deciding how to approach it.

West and the FO were evaluating whether Blake could perform like a superstar and be a leader, and he didn't perform as a superstar, though like a star, and Lou became the on court leader according to West and Griffin deferred to him and Bev was more of a locker room leader too.

When you're paying that much money to a player on a capped out team without another star/superstar, they have to be a bit better impact wise than what BG can give, at least if your goal is a championship. If you have 28 year old BG with already declining athleticism as your best player with no other star on a capped out team, you aren't a contender, especially not in the West. That contract also keeps going up for 5 years and the older he gets, the harder it is to trade him because BG, even though he's skilled, he's technically still an undersized PF because of his length, so when the athleticism fades further, things will get harder for him.

...ans sure, his off court stuff probably played some part in it, though it wouldn't be the biggest part IMO, more like just a final factor.


Agent0
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pageC4 wrote:
a team has a salary cap, and once they hit it there's little they can do to add and improve teams. Cleveland was in the same spot as we were : a playoff team with little room for big name free agents. There's no way they could add a kawhaii Leonard via free agents, so unless trades for these names came up (e.g. Kevin love) they can't acquire them. your

Proposed scenario with regard to Cleveland was the same that limited our ability to get a halfway decent free agent during CPs time here: cap limitations. This has nothing to do with Can Gilbert, and again if Gilbert was so terrible why did James return? As for Dolan see my earlier posts

I agree that Cleveland's inability to sign significant FA's is due to lack of cap space. Their location also plays a part in it when they have had cap space. Teams can't just sign whomever they want, there are rules, and a cap spike like 2016 doesn't happen, well, ever except for that time, so GS's situation is also abnormal.

Lebron returning to Cleveland though, that was for the fans, it's his hometown. One thing that can definitively overcome bad management or an undesirable location for stars players is wanting to play for their hometown or a team they have dreamed of playing of since they were young. Carmelo asking to be traded to the Knicks for example.


Agent0
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Clemenza wrote:
You're changing the subject. The Philly situation is a whole different topic and way worse than how we treated one player. The Philly situation is a sh*t storm right now. Like I said I haven't heard a WOJ tweet/bomb or a serious comment from a big time agent then there's no story on this and you're definitely or rather desperately trying to add fuel to a non-existent fire.

Plus our GM/man in charge is non other than Jerry West. The guy who's responsible for the Laker championship runs and who's constructed these current Golden State Warriors. He's got all the cred in the world.

Yea, Colangelo situation is players having internal things come out, that's a whole different situation.

Again, for the Clippers it might have a short lived effect, but BG's lack of being in the brotherhood of NBA players as much as other guys, Jerry West's acumen around the league as well as the Clippers location advantage are all things that can overcome that. If a team like Milwaukee or even Detroit did that, it would be more likely to be an issue for them.

It can still be an issue for the Clippers, but as I said before, more in the sense that they might need to do some extra convincing. The main issue for the Clippers will be with Blake's agent and anyone also represented by him, I don't know who that pertains to.


Jerediscool
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https://basketball.realgm.com/info/agen ... ldfeder/44

This is Blake’s agent and a list of all his clients.


pageC4
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bballman wrote:
Even the Knicks, with their terrible ownership were able to sign Amare Stoudemire and got Carmelo both in their prime. I realize Melo was traded there but that was where he forced the Nuggets to trade him to, basically.
Definitely supports the idea that ownership, or perceived incompetence of it, is negligible when other factors are concerned. Melo wanted to play on the east coast, and if I'm not mistaken I believe that he's from he NY area. For Melo the pull to play in NY was greater than the perception of James Dolan's incompetence.

There's also the pull of playing for your favorite childhood team too. Paul George was rumored to have wanted to come here, which was expressed even during the Sterling years.

https://clutchpoints.com/paul-george-gr ... d-by-them/


Agent0
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Jerediscool wrote:
https://basketball.realgm.com/info/agent-client-list/Sam-Goldfe der/44

This is Blake’s agent and a list of all his clients.

Looks like no one consequential


Griffinforpresident
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Agent0 wrote:
Looks like no one consequential

CJ McCollum

Marco Bellinelli

Mikal Bridges

Spencer Dinwiddle

Mario chalmers

Jarret Jack

Patrick Patterson

Isiah Thomas

Cody Zeller

Tyler Zeller

Blake is the biggest client.


pageC4
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Signs point to CP not taking a pay cut to help out the rockets. Of course, this may change as CP has to be realistic about the ability of the Rockets to improve the team if he demands and gets the max. Chris Paul won’t take discount on new contract As president of the NBA Players’ Union, Chris Paul has advised and pushed players such as Giannis Antetokounmpo not to take less than the max. He and LeBron James have told players that the owners make plenty of money on these teams, don’t cut them a break by taking less than the....


ClipperPostman
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The rockets FO has already said on record they had cp3’s contract situation worked out


toohipcliptoslip
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I have always felt that CP was an a**hole who has great stats but they do not translate into production. This is one man's opinion but K Mart seems quite reasonable and diplomatic and says the same thing. Everybody on the video seem to be expressing the opinion of the "grapevine but don't name names

See the first then 5:00 unless you want a conversation on analytics.


Griffinforpresident
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Hard for me to watch the second video because I detest Colin Cowbitch.


pageC4
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Griffinforpresident wrote:
Hard for me to watch the second video because I detest Colin Cowbitch.
I never understood why the networks like hiring provocateurs like that. Colin is bad, but I can't decide who is worse him or skip bayless


toohipcliptoslip
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Because controversy and a****** get ratings.


toohipcliptoslip
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And now for something not different at all:

I tried to post the link but couldn't. A player/announcer whose name I can't remember said something interesting about the locker room incident. First that BG actually tried to defuse the situation.

Secondly, he found CP's behavior inexcusable. The leader of the team is supposed to be the voice of reason, the eye of the hurricane, calm when the world is going to sh*t. Team mates look up to him and emulate his behavior. He sets the tone for the team.He is supposed to defuse situations like that. Instead, he instigated and lead the attack which is exactly what a leader SHOULD NOT do. He failed in his job as leader. The announcer said that often one team tells the other that they'll storm the locker room but they never do and this was unprecedented. The announcer wasn't too fond of CP. It might have been Jalen Rose (or not).

Not my words.


clipper*joe
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clipper*joe wrote:
Capela will get close to max. I am not convinced CP3 will be a Rocket next season.If he stays, I see him taking a big cut in salary. Not because he wants to, but because the Rockets won't commit to CP3 long term. I have a feeling Rockets might low-ball him. At his age, and injury history, expecting him to be healthy all the way to the finals is a pipe dream. Not only that, they're not a young team and most of their young assets, were traded away. It's only going to get worse as time passes because they're going into Clippers territory locking themselves into the same old players to keep that window open. Too much up and coming teams now with a lot of youth that you can't lock yourself up trying to beat the Warriors with the same cast. Thank god we don't have that problem anymore.

Oh crap, NO ONE saw this coming!

Report: Chris Paul, Rockets Have Tension On Contract Situation

"From what I'm told, there is tension now between Houston and Chris Paul. There was definitely some type of handshake, wink-wink, we're going to max you out last summer. Now, they're not so sure. Houston, with good reason, doesn't want to do that. They have an out because they have new ownership. So Daryl Morey can go to Chris Paul and be like 'I want to do it, but we've got the new owner and he doesn't want to give you five years.'

https://basketball.realgm.com/wiretap/2 ... -Situation


Griffinforpresident
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The one reporting that: Chris Broussard.

He’ll do anything to find some way to get lebron to the lakers by perhaps suggesting CP comes to the lakers as well when the lakers attempt of acquiring Kawhi failed.


clipper*joe
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Griffinforpresident wrote:
The one reporting that: Chris Broussard.

He’ll do anything to find some way to get lebron to the lakers by perhaps suggesting CP comes to the lakers as well when the lakers attempt of acquiring Kawhi failed.

https://www.foxsports.com/watch/the-her ... 1874755733


bballman
Clipper Starter
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Griffinforpresident wrote:
The one reporting that: Chris Broussard.

He’ll do anything to find some way to get lebron to the lakers by perhaps suggesting CP comes to the lakers as well when the lakers attempt of acquiring Kawhi failed.

It's sickening when you hear Stephen A. Smith, Chris Broussard and all the other ESPN guys try to talk LeBron into coming to the Lakers. It's like they are all Lakers fans. They aren't even trying to hide the fact that they are rooting for the Lakers.


pageC4
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Griffinforpresident wrote:
The one reporting that: Chris Broussard.

He’ll do anything to find some way to get lebron to the lakers by perhaps suggesting CP comes to the lakers as well when the lakers attempt of acquiring Kawhi failed.

Its interesting to see that so many of the networks and sports broadcasters are trying to keep the Lakers relevant. They continue to spin these false narratives in hopes that it will guide players to the Lakers. That sh#t needs to stop.


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